LPIN: Preferred job title?

[georoc01]

All of this makes me wonder why we would celebrate an award that has the "W" word in it.  I don't like it and have made my complaints to the awards team.  I even have gone so far as to say I don't want this SIN board to be affiliated with any awards that use the "W" word.  I own the domain for the CWMC Awards.  I pay for it because I inherited it when the site was given to me.  That site is really more of a curse to me than anything.  I have no desire to keep it going and no respect for anyone who would keep the name knowing what it means.

"Here!  Congratulations!  You're awesome!  BTW, the "W" on this trophy or certificate means WH*ORE" -- This really defeats the purpose of recognizing or building someone up for their accomplishments.  Seriously.

You may have noticed, but I took the "W" out of the name of this board and blocked those words a long time ago.  --OVER a year ago.

I think it would be a good change to remove the "W" from the awards and change the awards site to not have the "W" in it, and I wish the awards committee would seriously consider taking all references to the "W" word out of everything.

Times change and we must ourselves progress and change enough to understand that certain terms, while literally correct, carry an offensive connotation for the ladies we do business with.

Q

It was discussed during the festivities about such a change. So I agree with you. Times and views are evolving and changing. Everyone needs to adapt. The award for providers is "COY" not "WOY". A change to CCMC from LPIN Gathering would make equal sense.

I think the problem is that I don't think any of us truly fit the definition of the client of a Courtesan.

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/courtesan

Hence why when this was discussed in the past it was turned down.

[KittiMinx]

All of this makes me wonder why we would celebrate an award that has the "W" word in it.  I don't like it and have made my complaints to the awards team.  I even have gone so far as to say I don't want this SIN board to be affiliated with any awards that use the "W" word.  I own the domain for the CWMC Awards.  I pay for it because I inherited it when the site was given to me.  That site is really more of a curse to me than anything.  I have no desire to keep it going and no respect for anyone who would keep the name knowing what it means.

"Here!  Congratulations!  You're awesome!  BTW, the "W" on this trophy or certificate means WH*ORE" -- This really defeats the purpose of recognizing or building someone up for their accomplishments.  Seriously.

You may have noticed, but I took the "W" out of the name of this board and blocked those words a long time ago.  --OVER a year ago.

I think it would be a good change to remove the "W" from the awards and change the awards site to not have the "W" in it, and I wish the awards committee would seriously consider taking all references to the "W" word out of everything.

Times change and we must ourselves progress and change enough to understand that certain terms, while literally correct, carry an offensive connotation for the ladies we do business with.

Q

It was discussed during the festivities about such a change. So I agree with you. Times and views are evolving and changing. Everyone needs to adapt. The award for providers is "COY" not "WOY". A change to CCMC from LPIN Gathering would make equal sense.

I think the problem is that I don't think any of us truly fit the definition of the client of a Courtesan.

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/courtesan

Hence why when this was discussed in the past it was turned down.

But the question is - does it justify continuing to use an acronym that features a now outdated word a majority of providers would rather not have used to describe their profession? 60 years ago people said "gay" freely to refer to merriment but now that same word is more so associated with homosexuality and is now at times used in a derogatory fashion because of it. Same thing happened to the "W" word. To those who did this job years ago they may not have thought much of it but in the last couple of decades it's become a derogatory word aimed primarily at women (whether they are sex workers or not) and has little positive connotation to it.

Sure "Working Girl" and "Sex Worker" are also applicable titles for the job. But when it comes to naming things, sometimes words need to roll off the tongue better - have some poetry and nuance. The "W" could mean "Working Girl" but then when said aloud it doesn't have as good a ring to it. Then going to "Sex Worker" would add another letter to the acronym. Sex Worker is also used to describe those who work as exotic dancers, adult models, cam performers, pornographic content performers, etc it's not limited to just prostitution.

Words' meanings change all the time as language is something that continuously evolves. Sure the core dictionary definition for courtesan may not fit the types of services all clients receive from providers, but it is a more dignified term to use to describe the profession and, again, has a more poetic taste to it. It's all semantics, really. My personal perspective is that if there is going to be an organization that honors the industry and the workers in it, then it should strive to evolve with the changes in cultural climate and show respect when honoring the individuals and establishments. Like I said - you call the award for the Ladies "COY" not "WOY" out of respect. Changing the letter from a W to a C in the organization's acronym shouldn't be more of a hassle than that it would tie in to the whole awards process even more.

[Metalhead]

All of this makes me wonder why we would celebrate an award that has the "W" word in it.  I don't like it and have made my complaints to the awards team.  I even have gone so far as to say I don't want this SIN board to be affiliated with any awards that use the "W" word.  I own the domain for the CWMC Awards.  I pay for it because I inherited it when the site was given to me.  That site is really more of a curse to me than anything.  I have no desire to keep it going and no respect for anyone who would keep the name knowing what it means.

"Here!  Congratulations!  You're awesome!  BTW, the "W" on this trophy or certificate means WH*ORE" --
 This really defeats the purpose of recognizing or building someone up for their accomplishments.  Seriously.

You may have noticed, but I took the "W" out of the name of this board and blocked those words a long time ago.  --OVER a year ago.

I think it would be a good change to remove the "W" from the awards and change the awards site to not have the "W" in it, and I wish the awards committee would seriously consider taking all references to the "W" word out of everything.

Times change and we must ourselves progress and change enough to understand that certain terms, while literally correct, carry an offensive connotation for the ladies we do business with.

Q

It was discussed during the festivities about such a change. So I agree with you. Times and views are evolving and changing. Everyone needs to adapt. The award for providers is "COY" not "WOY". A change to CCMC from LPIN Gathering would make equal sense.

I think the problem is that I don't think any of us truly fit the definition of the client of a Courtesan.

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/courtesan

Hence why when this was discussed in the past it was turned down.

But the question is - does it justify continuing to use an acronym that features a now outdated word a majority of providers would rather not have used to describe their profession? 60 years ago people said "gay" freely to refer to merriment but now that same word is more so associated with homosexuality and is now at times used in a derogatory fashion because of it. Same thing happened to the "W" word. To those who did this job years ago they may not have thought much of it but in the last couple of decades it's become a derogatory word aimed primarily at women (whether they are sex workers or not) and has little positive connotation to it.

Sure "Working Girl" and "Sex Worker" are also applicable titles for the job. But when it comes to naming things, sometimes words need to roll off the tongue better - have some poetry and nuance. The "W" could mean "Working Girl" but then when said aloud it doesn't have as good a ring to it. Then going to "Sex Worker" would add another letter to the acronym. Sex Worker is also used to describe those who work as exotic dancers, adult models, cam performers, pornographic content performers, etc it's not limited to just prostitution.

Words' meanings change all the time as language is something that continuously evolves. Sure the core dictionary definition for courtesan may not fit the types of services all clients receive from providers, but it is a more dignified term to use to describe the profession and, again, has a more poetic taste to it. It's all semantics, really. My personal perspective is that if there is going to be an organization that honors the industry and the workers in it, then it should strive to evolve with the changes in cultural climate and show respect when honoring the individuals and establishments. Like I said - you call the award for the Ladies "COY" not "WOY" out of respect. Changing the letter from a W to a C in the organization's acronym shouldn't be more of a hassle than that it would tie in to the whole awards process even more.

First off I've have not read through all the post so my question might of already been answered. I do understand the dislike for the "W" word but what about prostitute or hooker I do see hooker used a lot in promotions at Hof houses. I generally use sex worker or sex therapist if I need to label things.

[KittiMinx]

Connotation is everything. Prostitute is very technical and clinical and even though it's a profession (and a legal profession in LPIN) to the mainstream it carries stigma. I know very few people in LPIN who will proudly say "I'm a legal prostitute!" because generally the response just isn't the same as even "I'm an exotic dancer!"

While "Hooker" may commonly be used by Hof PR, Ladies who do not work his houses and even some Ladies who do - are not fans of the word. Again, because of connotation and stigma.  I've only ever heard "hooker" used among Ladies in self-deprecating humor.

Since being a courtesan isn't all I do I just like to jokingly tell people I'm myself for a living - because I do s many things.  But for those where this is their main job and all they do the job title should reflect that with as little stigma and as positive connotation as possible (in my opinion).

I liken myself to historical figure Madame de Pompadour, especially how she was depicted in the Doctor Who episode "Girl In The Fireplace"-

"The Doctor: [quiet and confused] Poisson?...
[shocked and excited]
The Doctor: No, no, no way, Reinette Poisson? Later Madame D'Etoiles, later still mistress of Louis the XV, uncrowned Queen of French? Actress, artist, musician, dancer, courtesan. Fantastic gardener!
French Servant: Who the hell are you?
The Doctor: [triumphant] I'm the Doctor, and I just snogged Madame de Pompadour!"

Madame de Pompadour, historically, was a French prostitute and paid mistress of King Louis the XV (but because, well, French, she and the actual Queen got on fairly well). But she was a lady of other skills and talents who just happened to also have a talent for sensuality and sexuality and profited from her services. Like the modern Lady, Reinette Poisson was more than just a sex worker. She had a life and depth to her beyond that one aspect of herself. The term "courtesan" sounds nicer and more respectful to her as a full person in that regard.  The same as I feel it does to us in the modern era.

[LuvUShortTime]

As Kitti said, most counties use the word "prostitute" as the legal term and so, while it is not the term preferred by most, it is one that you have to legally accept when registering with the sheriff's office.  From names that individual ladies like to use for themselves, I've seen courtesan, companion, and lover a lot.  I haven't seen hooker used by anyone to describe herself seriously.  I've mostly heard "hooker" used alliteratively in things like "Hookers for Healthcare" or "Hooker Booker".  I would expect that a project aimed at seeking now homes for abandoned felines would be called "Courtesans for Cats" for the same effect.

I like generally referring to the ladies as, well ... "ladies".  I think that is confers a levels of dignity and respect that is due them without pigeonholing them into a certain type, class, or fetish.

[KittiMinx]

As Kitti said, most counties use the word "prostitute" as the legal term and so, while it is not the term preferred by most, it is one that you have to legally accept when registering with the sheriff's office.  From names that individual ladies like to use for themselves, I've seen courtesan, companion, and lover a lot.  I haven't seen hooker used by anyone to describe herself seriously.  I've mostly heard "hooker" used alliteratively in things like "Hookers for Healthcare" or "Hooker Booker".  I would expect that a project aimed at seeking now homes for abandoned felines would be called "Courtesans for Cats" for the same effect.

I like generally referring to the ladies as, well ... "ladies".  I think that is confers a levels of dignity and respect that is due them without pigeonholing them into a certain type, class, or fetish.

I eagerly await the day when MrTShirt, highdrive, and I have the ProstiDude Ranch and y'all will have to start saying Ladies and Gentlemen. 

[LuvUShortTime]

As Kitti said, most counties use the word "prostitute" as the legal term and so, while it is not the term preferred by most, it is one that you have to legally accept when registering with the sheriff's office.  From names that individual ladies like to use for themselves, I've seen courtesan, companion, and lover a lot.  I haven't seen hooker used by anyone to describe herself seriously.  I've mostly heard "hooker" used alliteratively in things like "Hookers for Healthcare" or "Hooker Booker".  I would expect that a project aimed at seeking now homes for abandoned felines would be called "Courtesans for Cats" for the same effect.

I like generally referring to the ladies as, well ... "ladies".  I think that is confers a levels of dignity and respect that is due them without pigeonholing them into a certain type, class, or fetish.

I eagerly await the day when MrTShirt, highdrive, and I have the ProstiDude Ranch and y'all will have to start saying Ladies and Gentlemen. 

But only if that is their preferred moniker/pronoun.  You are planning on being pansexual/transsexual/etc. inclusive at this ranch, correct?

[FumbleNutts]

Whatever you are all comfy with, I'm good. Just please don't change my favorite action verbs, fuck or fucking 

[KittiMinx]

As Kitti said, most counties use the word "prostitute" as the legal term and so, while it is not the term preferred by most, it is one that you have to legally accept when registering with the sheriff's office.  From names that individual ladies like to use for themselves, I've seen courtesan, companion, and lover a lot.  I haven't seen hooker used by anyone to describe herself seriously.  I've mostly heard "hooker" used alliteratively in things like "Hookers for Healthcare" or "Hooker Booker".  I would expect that a project aimed at seeking now homes for abandoned felines would be called "Courtesans for Cats" for the same effect.

I like generally referring to the ladies as, well ... "ladies".  I think that is confers a levels of dignity and respect that is due them without pigeonholing them into a certain type, class, or fetish.

I eagerly await the day when MrTShirt, highdrive, and I have the ProstiDude Ranch and y'all will have to start saying Ladies and Gentlemen. 

But only if that is their preferred moniker/pronoun.  You are planning on being pansexual/transsexual/etc. inclusive at this ranch, correct?

Hey - this is not the place for full SJ discourse - you want this to go to Fight Club? lmao but yes naturally it would be inclusive - you gotta be. People can use whatever pronouns they want. (I get called "it" a lot and I don't mind  )   I was making a joke because right now providers are referred to on here as "Ladies" but the future is bright and one day MrTShirt can service the masses with his 26 incher!

Whatever you are all comfy with, I'm good. Just please don't change my favorite action verbs, fuck or fucking 

Ahahaha when you have time look up "purple prose in erotica". You'll get a kick out of the myriad of flowery euphemisms people use in place of the good old fashioned F word.

[LuvUShortTime]

Hey - this is not the place for full SJ discourse - you want this to go to Fight Club? lmao but yes naturally it would be inclusive - you gotta be. People can use whatever pronouns they want. (I get called "it" a lot and I don't mind  )   I was making a joke because right now providers are referred to on here as "Ladies" but the future is bright and one day MrTShirt can service the masses with his 26 incher!

Yeah, I was trying to be funny too but right now I'm not communicating well because I'm still jet lagged.  Kitti, while you are at it getting the Prostidude ranch up and keeping net neutrality safe, could you also get prostitution legalized in our home state so I don't end up flying halfway across the country again only to miss your tour when we both spend most of our time in the same state?  Full disclosure, I did finalize my trip to Reno weeks ahead of when you listed your tour dates.

[KittiMinx]

Hey - this is not the place for full SJ discourse - you want this to go to Fight Club? lmao but yes naturally it would be inclusive - you gotta be. People can use whatever pronouns they want. (I get called "it" a lot and I don't mind  )   I was making a joke because right now providers are referred to on here as "Ladies" but the future is bright and one day MrTShirt can service the masses with his 26 incher!

Yeah, I was trying to be funny too but right now I'm not communicating well because I'm still jet lagged.  Kitti, while you are at it getting the Prostidude ranch up and keeping net neutrality safe, could you also get prostitution legalized in our home state so I don't end up flying halfway across the country again only to miss your tour when we both spend most of our time in the same state?  Full disclosure, I did finalize my trip to Reno weeks ahead of when you listed your tour dates.

Hey man, I'm also on a quest to end cetacean captivity and make the oceans more habitable for the diverse marine life that calls it home! Also so the plankton stop dying. Because if we keep losing phytoplankton that's going to affect all of the oxygen on the planet. The oxygen we need to live.  I know in grade school they tell us trees are what help us breathe and yes, trees are very important, but most of the planet is covered in ocean and it's the oxygen released from phytoplankton that does a large portion of the job giving us breathable air. And we need to stop killing dolphins, whales, sharks, rays, etc and with the fish, we catch to eat stop overfishing so the populations can grow and maintain themselves.... I have a lot of quests!

But yes decriminalization or trying to have a system like in Nevada is on my to-do list, unfortunately, there's still a lot of stigmas and it's going to take a very long time. Especially with people constantly still trying to bring religion into politics and the law.  I''m more likely to get SeaWorld to retire their whales to sanctuaries than change laws regarding sex work.

And I'm sorry I had to take off before we could meet but I'd already extended a day and couldn't afford to any longer this trip. I had my doctor's appointment early this morning for a follow up from that Uber accident and needed a couple days at home to settle and take care of things.  There will always be future trips!

[Catrina Costa]

I think the problem is that I don't think any of us truly fit the definition of the client of a Courtesan.

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/courtesan

Hence why when this was discussed in the past it was turned down.

I prefer the Wikipedia definition for "courtesan", which is somewhat implied by the very brief Webster definition: "A courtesan was a high-class prostitute or mistress especially one associated with rich, powerful, or noble men."

While we are "prostitutes", the legal term for our profession, in general use it sometimes carries negative connotations.

We are also "sex-workers", however, that term is way too broad, as someone else mentioned it also encompasses webcammers, porn stars, and strippers. And is not specific enough for my taste.

[TeeJay]

CWM is more about what the clients call themselves, rather than what the ladies are. What we are, in my mind, are sex mongers! But that's a bit too general.

"Cyber Courtesan Monger" doesn't roll off the tongue, loses the obviously raunchy original intent, and looks too obviously like a tin-eared word substitution. But if that's the best we can brainstorm, I wouldn't mind being called that. Almost anything's better than having the "W" word in the award, anyway.

[RoxyGold]

To me, words are words. If someone calls me a name that might have negative connotations but they have no bad intentions with it, I'm not bothered at all. My best-loved manager spouts curse words in a loving and humorous way all the time. It's awesome.

[sexylexiejames]

Alice, I think of you and a lot of the ladies are more like therapists for some guys. There are many different reasons why people go and pay for sex. Some clients want to go and just have fun, and don't have any personal issues, but there are some that do have personal issues and need therapy, guidance, counseling or whatever you want to call it. Social work is too broad of term, like calling all physicians doctors. In medicine you have your general practitioners, but you have so many specialized medical fields now that no one doctor is an "expert" with experience in all of them. The oncologist, brain, and heart specialists want to keep up with the latest news and developments in their own field, and don't have time to read or learn about other fields in depth and become experts. I guess that is why with some medical plans, you see a primary care physician that evaluates and can refer you to a specialized physician if you need one. I think of some of the brothel courtesans the same way, different levels of expertise and different levels of involvement with different clients. Client evaluation can take time to learn for both types of professionals. Some courtesans want to be a Jill of all trades and do everything, but with many of them that have worked a long time in the business have developed their own "specialties" that they excel in.
[/quote]

I like the way you think Isurfer! I see us this way as well and that makes it hard to put one specific title on it. I don't like the word escort as those are generally ladies not operating legally. While technically I am a prostitute, I think the title depends on the party... for a GFE I consider myself a courtesan, for a PSE I guess you could use sex worker. For married men, a professional mistress. For BDSM parties either a hired sub or Domme.
Its ever changing which is what is kind of cool about it!